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Post by Mike_B on Oct 18, 2019 8:19:20 GMT -8
More update . Stripped down the movement. Removed chrono wheel. Washed in Renata in the ultrasonic for 15 mins on a 50 deg C wash. Dried it Oiled and installed , rebuilt the watch.. Runs brilliant in both on and off configuration of the chrono ! Result Chrono off Chrono being switched on Chrono on
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pip
WS Benefactor
Berkshire, UK
Posts: 6,174
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Post by pip on Oct 18, 2019 8:59:46 GMT -8
Great result Mike, well done mate! Bet you’re a happy bunny.
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Oct 18, 2019 13:48:37 GMT -8
That's great news and looks like it's performing well. Must be relieved.
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Post by Mike_B on Oct 20, 2019 1:41:27 GMT -8
Well despite being very happy at my achievement , last night I set about fitting the hands. I had to relume them first and they are in poor condition . Someone must have tried to fit with a crowbar in the past as the scratches around the hole are astonishing . Once fitted I used one of VTAs 6139 movement holder that I had borrowed from a friend. I got it all setup to fit the chrono hand which I had been given as mine was missing. I had stripped the yellow paint off it and was going to paint in situ once fitted. I carefully balanced the hand on top ready to hold in fly back and align it all up when I noticed the monumental problem..... The hand is too long... So it’s back to the drawing board . Will have to find an aftermarket now to complete the project. Anyway I cased it so at least I can enjoy for now.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2019 7:34:12 GMT -8
Well despite being very happy at my achievement , last night I set about fitting the hands. I had to relume them first and they are in poor condition . Someone must have tried to fit with a crowbar in the past as the scratches around the hole are astonishing . Once fitted I used one of VTAs 6139 movement holder that I had borrowed from a friend. I got it all setup to fit the chrono hand which I had been given as mine was missing. I had stripped the yellow paint off it and was going to paint in situ once fitted. I carefully balanced the hand on top ready to hold in fly back and align it all up when I noticed the monumental problem..... The hand is too long... So it’s back to the drawing board . Will have to find an aftermarket now to complete the project. Anyway I cased it so at least I can enjoy for now. Are you sure this wasn't a 'service' replacement hand which is intended to be trimmed to length? The watch looks absolutely naked without it
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Post by Mike_B on Oct 20, 2019 7:36:21 GMT -8
Well despite being very happy at my achievement , last night I set about fitting the hands. I had to relume them first and they are in poor condition . Someone must have tried to fit with a crowbar in the past as the scratches around the hole are astonishing . Once fitted I used one of VTAs 6139 movement holder that I had borrowed from a friend. I got it all setup to fit the chrono hand which I had been given as mine was missing. I had stripped the yellow paint off it and was going to paint in situ once fitted. I carefully balanced the hand on top ready to hold in fly back and align it all up when I noticed the monumental problem..... The hand is too long... So it’s back to the drawing board . Will have to find an aftermarket now to complete the project. Anyway I cased it so at least I can enjoy for now. Are you sure this wasn't a 'service' replacement hand which is intended to be trimmed to length? The watch looks absolutely naked without it No the hand was given to me by a friend as my watch it was missing when I bought it. This hand is genuine seiko but we now think from a 6138 I have been advised to trim the end a little which is what I am going to do.
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Adrian-VTA
Global Moderator
Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 5,327
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Post by Adrian-VTA on Oct 20, 2019 20:08:28 GMT -8
Looks great.
Ah my "smoky" tool with the pink buttons! They were my favourite combo.
The hand just needs trimming to length. When new, at some point, they just supplied them in a universal length. The correct length is just to the edge of the minute track in most cases.
Another few things to check if misbehaving DU/DD when the chrono is or isnt engaged -
1. Sweep hand touching crystal 2. Top pivot jewel on the centre wheel dislodged, moved, tight, cracked 3. Chrono finger adjustment 4. Tight minute intermediate wheel 5. Worn bushes on minute wheel or intermediate wheel
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Oct 21, 2019 0:44:06 GMT -8
Ah my "smoky" tool with the pink buttons! They were my favourite combo. I need one of those, you got any in stock? Any recommendations for a better movement holders, thinking of the old round swiss ones. 4. Tight minute intermediate wheel 5. Worn bushes on minute wheel or intermediate wheel I would add missing intermediate wheel bushing. 😡 Are there replacement bushings? Maybe I will try fit a jewel. I could just replace the L and chrono plate.
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Adrian-VTA
Global Moderator
Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 5,327
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Post by Adrian-VTA on Oct 21, 2019 3:38:02 GMT -8
I have the tools on ebay. The newer version I'm supplying now is different but better, I haven't got round to updating the images. I do the 6170 as well, which is designed for general work. They probably did issue a replacement bushing but good luck finding it. It's usually stuffed in the top plate. So if you can find a spare top plate, you can just pull one from there. I did pull one a while ago from another movement that worked OK, but I can't remember what it was. Ah my "smoky" tool with the pink buttons! They were my favourite combo. I need one of those, you got any in stock? Any recommendations for a better movement holders, thinking of the old round swiss ones. 4. Tight minute intermediate wheel 5. Worn bushes on minute wheel or intermediate wheel I would add missing intermediate wheel bushing. 😡 Are there replacement bushings? Maybe I will try fit a jewel. I could just replace the L and chrono plate.
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Post by Mike_B on Oct 21, 2019 3:45:54 GMT -8
I have the tools on ebay. The newer version I'm supplying now is different but better, I haven't got round to updating the images. I do the 6170 as well, which is designed for general work. They probably did issue a replacement bushing but good luck finding it. It's usually stuffed in the top plate. So if you can find a spare top plate, you can just pull one from there. I did pull one a while ago from another movement that worked OK, but I can't remember what it was. I need one of those, you got any in stock? Any recommendations for a better movement holders, thinking of the old round swiss ones. I would add missing intermediate wheel bushing. 😡 Are there replacement bushings? Maybe I will try fit a jewel. I could just replace the L and chrono plate. I have your 6119 movement holder from George Clarkson however it’s made too tight and the movement does not sit in well. Always pops out unfortunately. Not sure if he printed it or you did pal.
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Post by Mike_B on Oct 21, 2019 3:47:07 GMT -8
kueI use a vintage Pioneer now British made. They do come up on eBay . Find it so much better than the Bergeon 4040
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Oct 21, 2019 3:55:23 GMT -8
I have the tools on ebay. The newer version I'm supplying now is different but better, I haven't got round to updating the images. I do the 6170 as well, which is designed for general work. They probably did issue a replacement bushing but good luck finding it. It's usually stuffed in the top plate. So if you can find a spare top plate, you can just pull one from there. I did pull one a while ago from another movement that worked OK, but I can't remember what it was. I need one of those, you got any in stock? Any recommendations for a better movement holders, thinking of the old round swiss ones. I would add missing intermediate wheel bushing. 😡 Are there replacement bushings? Maybe I will try fit a jewel. I could just replace the L and chrono plate. Thanks I will pick some up from you. I have already borrowed some from otherwise good plates.
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Oct 21, 2019 4:01:53 GMT -8
kueI use a vintage Pioneer now British made. They do come up on eBay . Find it so much better than the Bergeon 4040 Thanks for that. That looks so much more sturdier than the Bergeon. I suppose the Bergeon was made for swiss movements and not Seiko chronographs.
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Post by watchingtimepassby on Aug 4, 2020 8:58:59 GMT -8
What a beauty!
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Post by mousekar on Aug 10, 2020 8:34:16 GMT -8
Not to resurrect an older thread, but I'm gonna be starting on my own 6139's soon and I had a question for those with more experience. Do you clean the chronograph wheel or do you not clean the chronograph wheel? I have heard/seen/read both now, and I'm not entirely sure how to approach it. Then the follow up question would be, what oil do you use on the chrono wheel?
Thanks everyone for the help!
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Fergus
Needs a Life!
Posts: 2,943
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Post by Fergus on Aug 10, 2020 11:36:08 GMT -8
I cleaned and reoiled mine then read after it’s recommended not to. Mine has been functioning excellently since so take from that what you will.
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Aug 11, 2020 1:58:05 GMT -8
You must clean the wheel and oil. You can't oil until you have cleaned the wheel and as evident in Mike's post that he was having problems with the Chronograph off until he cleaned the wheel. Did I mention that you should clean the wheel?
Be interested to know what the reasoning behind not cleaning and oiling.
I have always oiled and that's the only way to make sure it runs the same with the chronograph off as it is on. You should have no detectable variation in amplitude with the chrono on or off.
It also stops the chronograph wheel from rusting and seizing and if you ever tried to remove a rusty cannon pinion then you have an idea.
Had a few rusted so much that it will stop the watch when the chrono is off or the sweep hand takes a few goes to zero. Had to clean these multiple times and it still not perfect with a drop of over 5° amplitude.
It is a delicate procedure and you will risk ruining the wheel if you slip. So if anything, at least clean the wheel.
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Post by mousekar on Aug 12, 2020 14:57:26 GMT -8
To be completely honest, I'm not exactly sure why you wouldn't clean it, but I got this information from a professional watchmaker. However, that said, he doesn't specialize in vintage Seiko.
Thank you all for you input. So what kind of oil are we talking about here? I'm thinking 9010, but I also have 9020 as well as HP1300 and HP500, but those seem a bit thicker than I would need.
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kue
Timekeeper
Posts: 598
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Post by kue on Aug 12, 2020 23:49:17 GMT -8
Most people who don't repair Seiko is because they don't think it is worth fixing and really don't know how Seiko Chronographs work.
The only thing I could find on why you wouldn't clean the chronograph wheel is because it has a "special oil", this would just be a 9010 equivalent back in the day.
I think we all agree that a mainspring needs to be cleaned and greased again after a service even though it was already greased at the factory.
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Fergus
Needs a Life!
Posts: 2,943
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Post by Fergus on Aug 13, 2020 6:06:29 GMT -8
If I may add to or amend my above post.
Having checked back I was using Seiko worksheets 6139A and 6139B while servicing my 6139B movement.
6139A uses clutch wheel 888-610 and shows lubrication.
6139B uses clutch wheel 888-612 BUT does not go to the length of showing or describing lubrication.
I assumed they were much the same so proceeded to clean and lubricate my 888-612.
I would rather do that than have a 40 year old part un serviced.
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