Not soliciting legal advice

[small]

Not soliciting legal advice but more a point in the right direction on the net. Maybe a link to an article? Court case? I plan to reach out next week to the company provided eap for actual advice but since I have google...and have, but not gotten any good hits with regard to a specific point.

The company has asked "key" employees to sign an employee agreement, in exchange for money. I guess they should have had these in place when we were hired but didn't and now they, as I understand it, can't make us. While they were passing them out they explained that they are standard and cannot be so restrictive as to hamper us from making a living. Between the non-compete and restrictive covenants it doesn't seem like I can't use my "expertise" with any company that I could use that expertise, on any continent but Antarctica a few countries in South America and SE Asia. 

As I have been reading, most courts side with former employees, when the agreement is too broad on its face. 

I guess what I'm after is an article or link to a case that actually mentions territorial restriction as broadly as "cannot work for; A,B,C,D,E,F co.'s in North America, Europe, Australia, New Zealand, X,Y,Z countries in south America, China and Taiwan...On its face that seems way to broad and would get tossed???

The only thing that I have issue with, since I'm loyal as can be to the current ownership, is the parts in the agreement that say the agreement continues even if ownership changes hands, and if I were to be let go for cause or "No" cause...I don't feel I owe them anything, and if they come in and I'm RIF'd I'd want to be able to continue doing what I love doing...it would just happen to be with the competition if they let me go.

Since the agreement would stand for two years after separation, should I just ask them to sign some sort of severance agreement to compensate me for the two years I could do what I have been doing to earn a living?

I really don't have any insight as to why now, other than we are seeing more "big" end user company's (our customers) buying up some of our competition. Maybe it has them nervous we "key" employees could be poached (enticed) to come work for them. We are truly the leaders in our industry, I'm not bragging I'm stating a fact. I don't know why as they are doing what they do similar to how we do it, but yet we still own market share only loosing because of....and there will be some retirements coming up and we have had several people turn over in engineering... 

I have read severance packages vary and can be as little as nothing, 2 weeks pay, 1 week for every year to two weeks for each year. We have a very nice benefits package on top of a "good" salary (I'm in the average range on salarydotcom) can I include that in asking for severance? I'd only ask for severance from the new owners if they decide to RIF our company, otherwise I would just continue do what I'm doing... 

Sorry a bit long winded and getting off track. Just been doing a bunch of reading and honestly it was like a kick in the gut after all these years and the effort I have put in to do my share making the company as great as I think it is.               


 

[philsinclair]

Hi. Sounds like a very amateurish attempt to get employees to sign a restrictive labour agreement. How much are they offering?They are wanking themselves if they think they can enforce that agreement outside of the country where it was signed. To add China in there is absolutely ludicrous. Good luck, you will probably sign it anyway, so when they decide how much cash you get (it’s taxable) tell them to add a Grand Seiko to the table. Cheers Phil

[Deleted]

Most of what you are describing cannot be enforced outside of your country and is seldom attempted.
I have had to sign many employment agreements and NDAs over the years. Most of the time I would go through them and make amendments then present it back to the company. If they were unreasonable, I moved on.

One time, the company I was working for was bought out and we had to sign a new agreement. We all missed and important clause of legaleeze that took away our company shares and gave them to the new management team. Twelve of our 23 people took out a class action suit against the new company and won current market value for the shares that were stolen from them.

Hopefully this isn't your case but don't hesitate to request changes to the agreement; if they truly value your contributions, they will make compromises. If not then don't sign anything because these things are always stacked in favour of the employer.

Have you considered contacting a labour lawyer?

[Adrian-VTA]

In my experience non compete clauses for employees are not worth the paper they're written on.

It's absurd to expect an employee not to work in the field they are experienced in for months or years. I don't think any magistrate or judge would allow that to stand if it came to that point.

It sounds like your boss got some terrible advice from a "HR Expert" or something along those lines.

I mean, to turn it around, if the company is so good, you wouldn't want to leave right?

I've found that these days, loyalty means nothing, You need to be out for yourself and constantly be looking for the best deal. Loyalty will cost you money and the only thanks you get is the thank you when you hand your keys to security as they escort you out the door.

If the contract is absurd, I'd refuse to sign it. Say the terms are ridiculous and take a stand on it. I know that's hard when you're down because you feel like you're getting screwed, but you just have to these days.

I don't think this would stand anywhere in any court in AU. We also have a government body that polices this kind of stuff and they would knock it down pretty quickly.

[small]

Thanks guys, most everything I have googled makes this seem overly broad and would get tossed if it came down to me working elsewhere. I'm 27 years in with at least 10 more until retirement age, although I enjoy it so much at this point I have no real desire.

I joked with one guy, who got one of the agreements, that I was going to have my "Compensation committee review it and get back with a list of changes"  I think I'm bringing philsinclair since he's looking to add to the ever growing collection, I joked that for my 30 year I should be getting a "nice watch". The 25 year "gift" was insulting to be honest...a vendor gives our Rolex and the salesmen was sporting an Airking...I could get behind that.

Back to geographic restrictions I've read, there are cases that have gone back and forth on verbiage as to "within a 15 mile radius" radius being the key. Seems a guy set up shop 15.5 miles away by any land route, following streets and such, he lost because radius means exactly that even though you can't actually travel in a straight line.

Other cases have stated that being overly broad and saying I couldn't take any job, even if its different than the one I held, also can't be enforced. A bird whispered a common workaround is to be an independent adviser/consultant, not working for the restricted company's listed directly, but another company all together...even if it was my own...

I think Adrian is on point when it comes to the why they are doing it. I know in some industries it's common when you begin as Pete has mentioned, here I think they are reacting to poor advise. 

Many of us have been talking to each other and others see no benefit to themselves in the agreement and aren't planning to sign. One guy asks "Does this still good if the company ever gets sold?" he was told that they'd have to check...I see it listed twice as being the case. Another Key guy spoke up and said if this was a contract with current ownership and ended with the same ownership he'd sign and never think about it again...His concern was potential new ownership...the pres looked shock and said he'd have to look in to that. I wonder if the Legal team didn't just pull up a template form the net and filled in the blanks. (enter company name here)... (enter territories)....(enter competition here). 


As Pete mentioned I may reach out to an attorney after the holidays...I figure I'll start jotting down a separation agreement list of what I'd like if I were to sign and then be let go...Because of the taxable nature I think I'll have it divided over a period of several years so as not to make such a huge impact...


Again thanks for the input