small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742 
|
Post by small on Jun 17, 2017 9:17:17 GMT -8
So I won a "lot" the other day; which included a well worn LeGant Divers watch. LeGant I have found out was a House Brand of the now out of business (brick and mortar) Montgomery Ward Department store. While it is marked Swiss Made on the back I think they are taking some liberty with that. The Bezel is shot and the case is a snap back to look like a screw back, stainless back but chrome case. Seeing the wear, I figured it had to run well enough for the owner to wear it out. Popped the back and found a UT29c movement which I need help IDing as to which Seiko it is. Again maybe we could have something in the reference section that has the UT VS. Seiko. The watch movement seems pretty cheap for a Seiko. Or at least compared to the Seiko movements I've worked with I wouldn't say it's Timex Pin Escapement quality but...The gears "seem" light. The fourth Wheel (passes through the center wheel controls the seconds hand)has a small chrome shim under it...The chrome on the winding Pinon looks cheap compared to others I have seen... The way the day changes with a goofy spring looking thing. The click stop under the ratchet wheel? Taking all that into account, the wear this watch is showing means it worked, and more likely than not, worked well. Stealing from another watch maker "It takes a licking and keeps on ticking" or at least it did until I got the back off then it stopped. But that is the point of servicing this. I imagine it will be a hell of a time keeper. So without too much more; the photos of the disassembly. I didn't get it back together yet as I pinged a Diafix spring into...I don't have a spare because I have not id'd the movement. So if anyone knows which movement this is, the part number for the spring and where I could find one please let me know. (I do have a parts 6119 that has diafix but not sure if they are all the same or not...) Actually had the going, going, great swing on the balance, when the dia popped on the escape wheel arbor. While trying to get it in I dropped it into the running movement. I stripped it and found it under the barrel. While trying again to get the little Bas***D back in, away it went. Pretty straight forward dial side to going side, going back together is in reverse order. Better photo taken from the web.  Crown is out to set the hands before I thought to snap the photos. Yes the bezel has marking but they are all but gone. Once seller, refers that that as a "ghost" bezel... just hat you want when your trying to determine your time underwater. Dial side first    This little bit is the click stop, moving it clockwise and holding it allows you to take down the MS>  The hands have darkened a bit but the dial is in fantastic shape lume on the markers is a bit lighter color.           Here in person this looks like some pretty cheap stamping not machining...    Here is the weird date finger with a tiny spring holding it. I din"t play with the date before disassembly. Since so far all the manual wind watches I've done either have a quick set date or don't have date function; I'm guessing the spring allows you to rotate the hands anti-clockwise 3am back to 9pm to adjust the date.   Setting bridge looks "thin" (tired of typing cheap)          Really not much to it.  Forgot the cannon pinion  Going    Trying to show the click stop and spring arrangement.      There is that little washer/shim I mentioned.        The barrel is brass, not even plated only the clover. I pulled the main spring and its a spring like any other.    |
|
GuyJ
Needs a Life!
Whitley Bay, UK
Posts: 2,885
|
Post by GuyJ on Jun 17, 2017 9:59:36 GMT -8
|
|
longbike
Is a Permanent Fixture
Aqualand Addict
Posts: 6,976
|
Post by longbike on Jun 17, 2017 11:49:18 GMT -8
Aloha Sir, small these movements are all used in ...... Vietnam Westclox Military Watch's during the 1968 to 1970 issued watch's also. They are also in the Westclox dress watchs Louis A-201 , D-401 , D-441 , Seiko ...66B , D-447 Louis  |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 17, 2017 13:13:52 GMT -8
Thanks Guy, but my bridge is two piece? The barrel bridge and then train bridge? The 66 has one combining both? The plates look identical, not sure anyone could tell the difference just looking at photos between the two. Borels doesn't have the diafix springs listed...I wonder who my sell these. |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 17, 2017 13:18:19 GMT -8
Aloha Sir, small these movements are all used in ...... Vietnam Westclox Military Watch's during the 1968 to 1970 issued watch's also. They are also in the Westclox dress watchs Louis A-201 , D-401 , D-441 , Seiko ...66B , D-447 Louis Thanks Louis I remember you commenting on the one Westcolx I saw for auction. Those were just marked with the A-241 no UT or Seiko. I'll be keeping a keener eye out for them (as well as 66) and to try and grab some spares. Like I mentioned in the reply to Guy, my movement has two bridges vs. one? I have to imagine all the parts should interchange though. |
|
GuyJ
Needs a Life!
Whitley Bay, UK
Posts: 2,885
|
Post by GuyJ on Jun 17, 2017 13:54:15 GMT -8
Aloha Sir, small these movements are all used in ...... Vietnam Westclox Military Watch's during the 1968 to 1970 issued watch's also. They are also in the Westclox dress watchs Louis A-201 , D-401 , D-441 , Seiko ...66B , D-447 Louis Thanks Louis I remember you commenting on the one Westcolx I saw for auction. Those were just marked with the A-241 no UT or Seiko. I'll be keeping a keener eye out for them (as well as 66)  and to try and grab some spares. Like I mentioned in the reply to Guy, my movement has two bridges vs. one? I have to imagine all the parts should interchange though. Looking at the bridge here it looks like it is a match? I wonder if it would fit. ..  |
|
GuyJ
Needs a Life!
Whitley Bay, UK
Posts: 2,885
|
Post by GuyJ on Jun 17, 2017 13:59:06 GMT -8
Only thing it looks to be missing is the break in the 'winding wheel?' plate and then the join is there that extends over the fourth wheel into the barrel bridge.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2017 14:29:53 GMT -8
Thanks Guy, but my bridge is two piece? The barrel bridge and then train bridge? The 66 has one combining both? The plates look identical, not sure anyone could tell the difference just looking at photos between the two. Borels doesn't have the diafix springs listed...I wonder who my sell these. This pic shows two versions of the basic 66 calibre...  You can see the one piece plate on the 66B and the two piece plate on the 6660. ![]() |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 17, 2017 16:26:12 GMT -8
Thanks all I'm going with base of 66 mostly since it has a date function 6602?
Now the quest for spare springs.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2017 17:30:44 GMT -8
Thanks all I'm going with base of 66 mostly since it has a date function 6602? Now the quest for spare springs. I'll check my stock...might have to sell you a whole movement for $999  Seriously though, I will check to see if we can't get you back on the road with some bits. |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 19, 2017 16:32:13 GMT -8
Okay I took a diafix from a 6119 hoping they were the same. After a minute of fiddling I lost that one too. Grabbed the other from the 6119 and went at it. I got it this time and the LeGant is back together running and functioning as it should. I'll put it on the timegrapher in a few days to see how I did. A curious thing. The diafix setting is unlike that of all the other diafix pictures I have come across. Both diafix on this movement have a small cutout in the setting like the diashock's have. The 6119 doesn't have it and google images didn't show any with? On the dial side spring, that I didn't lose, the "handle of the fork" or "Tab end" is opposite the cut out? I messed with the one on the going side so much I just made it work. Its off to the side enough, I don't see it being an issue. Believe me when I say I was tempted to make it like the other side only I'm not positive the other side is right either? Anyone out there have any ideas about this? Do the 66xx series all have it? Should the tab be opposite? Is this maybe unique to the UT Seiko's? After losing two of those little guys I'd really like a source for them rather than cannibalizing from other movements. (Unless of course like the Ramon 6119 its just parts anyway.) This isn't a tough movement to work on provided I/you don;t lose that little spring. Again I had no intention of removing it, it just happened. While it looks as though part numbers for these can be different from movement to movement are the parts themselves different?    |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 22, 2017 4:28:00 GMT -8
Quick update. This bad boys gained 4 seconds in almost 5 days! Unreal!
Still love to hear about the odd cut out on the diafix frame...
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2017 7:44:20 GMT -8
Quick update. This bad boys gained 4 seconds in almost 5 days! Unreal! Still love to hear about the odd cut out on the diafix frame... It really looks like a Diashock frame. I wonder if they are interchangeable. There certainly is no mechanical reason for it with the Diafix spring. |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 22, 2017 9:00:19 GMT -8
Quick update. This bad boys gained 4 seconds in almost 5 days! Unreal! Still love to hear about the odd cut out on the diafix frame... It really looks like a Diashock frame. I wonder if they are interchangeable. There certainly is no mechanical reason for it with the Diafix spring. That's the thing, this movement while it resembles the 6602 so closely, it is different. The cut out for one and the two piece bridge on this,where the Seiko Branded is just one piece. I'd be kind of surprised that Seiko would make a "totally Different" movement for their off-brand? Again the consistency with Seiko, is never say always.... Also The frame looks smaller than a Diashock. I didn't measure the difference but I would think it would have to be. If its not I wonder if I could swap in a Shock in place of a Fix??? Shock springs are much easier to harvest then the Diafix ones... |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2017 12:07:53 GMT -8
It really looks like a Diashock frame. I wonder if they are interchangeable. There certainly is no mechanical reason for it with the Diafix spring. That's the thing, this movement while it resembles the 6602 so closely, it is different. The cut out for one and the two piece bridge on this,where the Seiko Branded is just one piece. I'd be kind of surprised that Seiko would make a "totally Different" movement for their off-brand? Again the consistency with Seiko, is never say always.... Also The frame looks smaller than a Diashock. I didn't measure the difference but I would think it would have to be. If its not I wonder if I could swap in a Shock in place of a Fix??? Shock springs are much easier to harvest then the Diafix ones... If you look closely at the picture I posted above, you will see that the 6660A calibre has a two piece bridge. So they already had the stuff to use as third party eubaches. The picture isn't good enough to see but I'll try and check the 6660A tonight to see if it has this strange Diafix frame. |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 22, 2017 15:10:38 GMT -8
That's the thing, this movement while it resembles the 6602 so closely, it is different. The cut out for one and the two piece bridge on this,where the Seiko Branded is just one piece. I'd be kind of surprised that Seiko would make a "totally Different" movement for their off-brand? Again the consistency with Seiko, is never say always.... Also The frame looks smaller than a Diashock. I didn't measure the difference but I would think it would have to be. If its not I wonder if I could swap in a Shock in place of a Fix??? Shock springs are much easier to harvest then the Diafix ones... If you look closely at the picture I posted above, you will see that the 6660A calibre has a two piece bridge. So they already had the stuff to use as third party eubaches. The picture isn't good enough to see but I'll try and check the 6660A tonight to see if it has this strange Diafix frame. Thanks Pete Yep I see that again. I had been google searching the movements and the one you show did show up but the vast majority are one piece. Those watches I see listed with the 6602 all seem to be more than I care to afford. I guess buying this was a good way to experience the movement...So far its been a fantastic runner. I should have known by the condition it was in... Now to find some hands since well I just bought another with Baron in the dial that is missing them... |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2017 17:07:56 GMT -8
This should give you a clue...  Those cutouts are for Diafix that use the three sided springs. This means they can use either type of spring with the same holder  |
|
small
WS Benefactor
Posts: 2,742
|
Post by small on Jun 23, 2017 18:45:58 GMT -8
This should give you a clue... Those cutouts are for Diafix that use the three sided springs. This means they can use either type of spring with the same holder Next movement that comes my way I'll give that a try. Since I have had zero luck finding diafix springs sold separately of movements.. |
|
ausimax
Timekeeper
Kogan, Qld, Australia
Posts: 937
|
Post by ausimax on Jun 23, 2017 20:15:41 GMT -8
|
|
longbike
Is a Permanent Fixture
Aqualand Addict
Posts: 6,976
|
Post by longbike on Jun 23, 2017 20:19:13 GMT -8
Aloha Sir, small, I think this might be one of them you are getting in the mail or maybe another. I have this one and it purr's really nice, and I cleaned and serviced it too. No strap or Bracelet on it at all. It's a nice little beautiful watch though, but like I said ...Little. Louis      NOTE : THESE TWO BELOW - This is UN-STAMPED ..... French-Jim Braun Movement also used in many ....... Vietnam WestClox Metal Case Watch's.    |
|
