HiBeat
Global Moderator
SEIKO Iko Iko GDTRWS
Posts: 8,663 
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Post by HiBeat on Jul 1, 2020 17:04:57 GMT -8
Not sure about any of the Seiko Boutiques except for sure the flagship Boutique in New York City. In the past besides being a Grand Seiko Boutique they also carried the best (and most expensive) of the Prospex and Presage upscale 'non-GS' models. It adds so much to the experience to see the Grand Seikos and the best of the rest (SLA017, SLA025, SLA033, all the new releases for 2020 with 8L calibers, Astron, Presage Limited Editions, etc.).
I had a pre-order on the SPB127 (SARX069) Presage L.E. due in before COVID hit NYC. They still are not opened back up. I have been following up with them and this is what I was told today:
"We were just notified last week that we will no longer carry Seiko in our NY location, as a consequence, we will not get any of the novelties moving forward. The NY store is becoming a Grand Seiko store only "
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Post by nordlys on Jul 1, 2020 22:34:41 GMT -8
Frustrating for normal consumers, but it makes sense from a marketing/brand placement standpoint. From Grand Seiko's aggressive marketing over the last few years and the amount of money they've been pumping into the watch journalists' coffers to hug their nuts (looking at you Hodinkee), it's very clear that Seiko is trying to position Grand Seiko in the same sphere as Rolex on the international stage. To achieve that level of regard, they need to distance themselves from Seiko, which is the obvious reason for the logo change in 2017.
While there's still some excellent quality "Normal Seikos" out there, unfortunately the general public perceives Seiko as a low price mall-store watch. So if they want to make their GS boutiques "exclusive" and "premium," they cannot have the Grand Seikos intermingled with "lowly" Seikos.
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Post by leffemonster on Jul 1, 2020 23:16:50 GMT -8
Interestingly the London boutique (SEIKO’s European flagship store remember) was also re-branded ‘Grand Seiko Boutique’ earlier this year, yet they continue to offer the Presage and Prospex ranges. HiBeat - does this shift mean that your pre-order SPB127J1 may now not be fulfilled? |
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HiBeat
Global Moderator
SEIKO Iko Iko GDTRWS
Posts: 8,663
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Post by HiBeat on Jul 2, 2020 2:45:08 GMT -8
Interestingly the London boutique (SEIKO’s European flagship store remember) was also re-branded ‘Grand Seiko Boutique’ earlier this year, yet they continue to offer the Presage and Prospex ranges. HiBeat - does this shift mean that your pre-order SPB127J1 may now not be fulfilled? Definitely not able to fill the SPB127 order Nick. They bowed out. Not hard to find online though. |
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HiBeat
Global Moderator
SEIKO Iko Iko GDTRWS
Posts: 8,663
|
Post by HiBeat on Jul 2, 2020 2:47:09 GMT -8
Frustrating for normal consumers, but it makes sense from a marketing/brand placement standpoint. From Grand Seiko's aggressive marketing over the last few years and the amount of money they've been pumping into the watch journalists' coffers to hug their nuts (looking at you Hodinkee), it's very clear that Seiko is trying to position Grand Seiko in the same sphere as Rolex on the international stage. To achieve that level of regard, they need to distance themselves from Seiko, which is the obvious reason for the logo change in 2017. While there's still some excellent quality "Normal Seikos" out there, unfortunately the general public perceives Seiko as a low price mall-store watch. So if they want to make their GS boutiques "exclusive" and "premium," they cannot have the Grand Seikos intermingled with "lowly" Seikos. Fully agreed. One small counterpoint:. Wouldn't a $5400 range Prospex dive watch benefit from the association with GS in a Boutique setting ? |
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Post by leffemonster on Jul 2, 2020 3:15:12 GMT -8
Interestingly the London boutique (SEIKO’s European flagship store remember) was also re-branded ‘Grand Seiko Boutique’ earlier this year, yet they continue to offer the Presage and Prospex ranges. HiBeat - does this shift mean that your pre-order SPB127J1 may now not be fulfilled? Definitely not able to fill the SPB127 order Nick. They bowed out. Not hard to find online though. That’s a shame Jon, but so long as you get your deposit back and secure one elsewhere I guess it’s no big deal. |
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Post by nordlys on Jul 2, 2020 3:59:01 GMT -8
Frustrating for normal consumers, but it makes sense from a marketing/brand placement standpoint. From Grand Seiko's aggressive marketing over the last few years and the amount of money they've been pumping into the watch journalists' coffers to hug their nuts (looking at you Hodinkee), it's very clear that Seiko is trying to position Grand Seiko in the same sphere as Rolex on the international stage. To achieve that level of regard, they need to distance themselves from Seiko, which is the obvious reason for the logo change in 2017. While there's still some excellent quality "Normal Seikos" out there, unfortunately the general public perceives Seiko as a low price mall-store watch. So if they want to make their GS boutiques "exclusive" and "premium," they cannot have the Grand Seikos intermingled with "lowly" Seikos. Fully agreed. One small counterpoint:. Wouldn't a $5400 range Prospex dive watch benefit from the association with GS in a Boutique setting ? Sure, but it still says "Seiko" on the dial. I guess they're really pushing hard to differentiate GS and ensure the public views it as a completely separate entity. |
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Post by jennie on Jul 2, 2020 7:32:50 GMT -8
Since Seiko is separating the GS from the rest of it's offerings; will the non GS watches now be priced lower to match customer perceptions?
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Post by nordlys on Jul 2, 2020 21:23:06 GMT -8
Since Seiko is separating the GS from the rest of it's offerings; will the non GS watches now be priced lower to match customer perceptions? Haha I wish. Seems like all Seikos are moving up-market. Gone are the days of the $350 SARB and $70-80 Seiko 5. |
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Post by huangcjz on Jul 2, 2020 23:10:50 GMT -8
Since Seiko is separating the GS from the rest of it's offerings; will the non GS watches now be priced lower to match customer perceptions? No, they publicly stated at the end of 2018 that their new strategy is the opposite - they are pulling Grand Seiko up in price, and also pulling Seiko up in price to fill the gap that's left by Grand Seiko moving up in price, in order to elevate people's perception of what they're worth: "Grand Seiko will also move further upmarket, Le Troadec [of Grand Seiko of America (GSA), formerly of OMEGA] says. "The new product and new technology that is coming at the next Baselworld will strengthen our brand in a higher price point: $7,000 and above is our target."... In addition to Grand Seiko, GSA will also distribute small upmarket collections of Seiko Presage mechanical watches and Seiko Prospex sports watches. These so-called "Seiko Prestige" lines will be priced in the affordable luxury range, below Grand Seiko but above core Seiko. They are part of Tokyo's "global brand" strategy for moving into the luxury range internationally. The global brands are Grand Seiko, Prospex, Presage and Astron."... SCA turned to... a well-known American consulting company... which SCA declined to name... in 2015 after years of eroding market share in the U.S. The study concluded that Seiko would not recover its once dominant position in the mid-market and recommended Seiko move upmarket." Source: www.hodinkee.com/articles/grand-seiko-united-states-move-upmarketThe Seiko Prestige watches are stuff like the PROSPEX LX range and SRQ029, and the PRESAGE SRQ031, SRQ033, SNR037, SNR039, SNR047, mechanical chronograph and Spring Drive ranges, and PRESAGE SJE073, SJE075, SJE077, SJE079, SJE081, SPB093, SPB095, and SPB171, which are all about $2,200 - $5,500 USD. These are all about twice the price, or more, of the watches that came before them. They have a new URL to indicate that they're luxury watches: seikoluxe.com . |
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Post by jennie on Jul 3, 2020 7:25:19 GMT -8
Since Seiko is separating the GS from the rest of it's offerings; will the non GS watches now be priced lower to match customer perceptions? No, they publicly stated at the end of 2018 that their new strategy is the opposite - they are pulling Grand Seiko up in price, and also pulling Seiko up in price to fill the gap that's left by Grand Seiko moving up in price, in order to elevate people's perception of what they're worth: "Grand Seiko will also move further upmarket, Le Troadec [of Grand Seiko of America (GSA), formerly of OMEGA] says. "The new product and new technology that is coming at the next Baselworld will strengthen our brand in a higher price point: $7,000 and above is our target."... In addition to Grand Seiko, GSA will also distribute small upmarket collections of Seiko Presage mechanical watches and Seiko Prospex sports watches. These so-called "Seiko Prestige" lines will be priced in the affordable luxury range, below Grand Seiko but above core Seiko. They are part of Tokyo's "global brand" strategy for moving into the luxury range internationally. The global brands are Grand Seiko, Prospex, Presage and Astron."... SCA turned to... a well-known American consulting company... which SCA declined to name... in 2015 after years of eroding market share in the U.S. The study concluded that Seiko would not recover its once dominant position in the mid-market and recommended Seiko move upmarket." Source: www.hodinkee.com/articles/grand-seiko-united-states-move-upmarketThe Seiko Prestige watches are stuff like the PROSPEX LX range and SRQ029, and the PRESAGE SRQ031, SRQ033, SNR037, SNR039, SNR047, mechanical chronograph and Spring Drive ranges, and PRESAGE SJE073, SJE075, SJE077, SJE079, SJE081, SPB093, SPB095, and SPB171, which are all about $2,200 - $5,500 USD. These are all about twice the price, or more, of the watches that came before them. They have a new URL to indicate that they're luxury watches: seikoluxe.com . That is sad. I guess my Seiko journey will be limited to vintage and used older models. But that is ok because once anyone has worn a watch it is used anyway  |
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Post by philsinclair on Jul 3, 2020 15:54:17 GMT -8
Hi. Who knows what is going on in the background. Bear in mind the Seiko Epson ,the manufacturer of Grand Seiko, is a separate company.A look at the Tokyo Stock Exchange list of shareholders for Epson will show that nearly all of the stock is held by Japanese Banks, Insurance companies and other large institutions. Last time I looked Hattori family only had around 6% and only Seiko companies only minor holdings. Maybe the board is trending towards separating the brand a little more from standard Seiko lines. With such separation are they marketing their brand themselves? Cheers Phil
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Post by nordlys on Jul 3, 2020 22:35:28 GMT -8
Hi. Who knows what is going on in the background. Bear in mind the Seiko Epson ,the manufacturer of Grand Seiko, is a separate company.A look at the Tokyo Stock Exchange list of shareholders for Epson will show that nearly all of the stock is held by Japanese Banks, Insurance companies and other large institutions. Last time I looked Hattori family only had around 6% and only Seiko companies only minor holdings. Maybe the board is trending towards separating the brand a little more from standard Seiko lines. With such separation are they marketing their brand themselves? Cheers Phil Seiko Epson (Shiojiri factory) doesn't manufacture all Grand Seikos. They manufacturer the Spring Drive and high accuracy quartz models for Grand Seiko, but they also manufacture the SD and HAQ models for "normal" Seiko (Like the new Presage Spring Drive line) and also for Credor. The Morioka factory (Seiko Instruments) still makes the mechanical models for Grand Seiko, as well as for the higher tier "normal" Seikos and Credor. |
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