ibr
Can't Tell Time
Posts: 24 
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Post by ibr on Nov 4, 2014 15:54:02 GMT -8
Got this Weekdater for fairly cheap. I was wondering if anyone recognizes the odd film/residue on the face. It looks almost like mold, and I was wondering whether that was something I could easily clean off on my own?  |
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 4, 2014 17:23:10 GMT -8
Don't know exactly from your shot, but it could be either: 1. Something in the layer of clear lacquer used to cover the dial paint. or 2. Under the lacquer layer. I'd been told that by a Seiko watch repairer/restorer/modder years ago. He always advised caution in attempting to clean up such things. Unless it is just a light surface residue/deposit ( on top of the lacquer) and NOT the lacquer itself, you would actually do more damage to the dial than help by attempting a cleaning. Haven't got personal hands-on experience w/ attempting a cleaning, but that was the advice from someone else who does such things for a living. But, to quote someone else a long time ago: free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it!!  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 18:10:51 GMT -8
You'll not be able to clean that dial up sorry to say. You can clean a dirty dial if your lucky but when it's under the paint your screwed for a lack of a better word. There is no primer used on these dials so when moisture gets under the paint it goes funky hence your dial looking the way it does right now. Option 1. Live with it. I would  Still a nice and seldom seen model. Option 2. Professional repaint. Down side is expensive option. Option 3. Keep your eye out for a good secondhand dial. (speedtimerkollection.com a good source for used spares). Sorry not great news but still a great watch! Enjoy |
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cobrajet25
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Post by cobrajet25 on Nov 4, 2014 19:53:48 GMT -8
 Ninja Cockroach It likely is a problem with the lacquer on the dial. Looks like it is flaking off. There probably isn't much you are going to be able to do about it. Look for a donor dial. Although this is a rare model, goldtone watches of this vintage don't tend to sell for much unless they are immaculate. You might have to look awhile for a replacement dial, but it should be relatively cheap when found.
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 4, 2014 20:09:07 GMT -8
RE: " Got this Weekdater for fairly cheap" Question: Do you actually have the watch "in hand" (no pun intended with respect to your picture) or is it still "on the way" from a seller?? Reason I ask: a good number of times in my experience, the seller's shots (especially @ magnification) make a problem look really serious, but when you get the watch & see it in natural light at natural size (life-size), an apparent problem often diminishes in seriousness. Cobra: Yes, good advice!! If a "sprucing up" is indeed needed, cannibalizing is otten the best (and most cost-effective) solution to these matters. |
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cobrajet25
Needs a Life!
"Underweared curmudgeon!"
Posts: 3,357
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Post by cobrajet25 on Nov 4, 2014 20:39:56 GMT -8
RE: " Got this Weekdater for fairly cheap" Question: Do you actually have the watch "in hand" (no pun intended with respect to your picture) or is it still "on the way" from a seller?? Reason I ask: a good number of times in my experience, the seller's shots (especially @ magnification) make a problem look really serious, but when you get the watch & see it in natural light at natural size (life-size), an apparent problem often diminishes in seriousness. Cobra: Yes, good advice!! If a "sprucing up" is indeed needed, cannibalizing is otten the best (and most cost-effective) solution to these matters. Agreed, but it looks like the minute track is wiped out as well. |
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 4, 2014 23:33:04 GMT -8
... ... Agreed, but it looks like the minute track is wiped out as well. You could be right about that too ... pics are too small on my screen to say for sure. BUT: just because there are no minute indications on the main dial chapter doesn't mean anything is missing!! Check out my 6218-8971 Weekdater examples. The minute indications are only on the outer dial chapter (ring). It could be that this one is designed the same way. #1  Now, the outer dial chapter on the one above does have some problems, but the main dial is as it should be. #2  A later example with some logos/text removed on the dial, but showing the same basic configuration. #3  Another of the early production dial type. Contrast those with the 6218-8950 dial design:  Now that one does indeed have minute indications painted on the main dial as there isn't any outer chapter/ring with the painted markers. Same basic design (as the -8971 above) on certain 6206 models:  One of mine from years ago. Note the same basic configuration with NO minute indications on main dial, but instead they are on that outer ring/chapter of the dial. I think this model is an -8990. Can't remember for sure & I have no case-back shot. |
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cobrajet25
Needs a Life!
"Underweared curmudgeon!"
Posts: 3,357
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Post by cobrajet25 on Nov 4, 2014 23:39:12 GMT -8
It was the markers on the dial ring that I was referring to. They are clearly gone...and you can see where they were. I don't think this model had minute markers on the dial.
When the dial ring has damage similar to what is perceived on the dial, it is a pretty good sign that the angle of the picture isn't the problem.
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 4, 2014 23:43:22 GMT -8
It was the markers on the dial ring that I was referring to. They are clearly gone...and you can see where they were. I don't think this model had minute markers on the dial. When the dial ring has damage similar to what is perceived on the dial, it is a pretty good sign that the angle of the picture isn't the problem. Hmmm. I'm not sure which markers you're referring to then. I just blew up the shot in my Firefox browser using their zoom feature. I am seeing white marker lines in that outer ring when I do that. I'm not saying everything that should be there is there, but I am seeing something that looks like a lot of both minor and major marker painted lines (white on a dark/black background in the ring). I'm thinking the ring design of that example in the main post is the "photographic negative" (in a sense) of my watches. Here's another example of mine, a cal. 395 Model J13.083  Again here showing black lines on white background of the ring. His example appears to be black ring background with white(ish?) lines. What I think he has is (in visual effect) similar to this Advan:  In other words, an outer dial chapter which is dark or black in color on which are painted white(ish) marker lines. While this Advan is not created in the same way (on here, the outer chapter is not a painted metal or plastic ring) it amounts to the same kind of visual effect. BTW: It seems his example is a 6206 as it has 26 jewels & is a Seikomatic (when I blow up the dial shot of his I see the jewel count now) plus the dial configuration is very similar to my 6206-8990 {I did confirm it as a -8990 thru another source}. What am I missing?? |
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Post by pollythecat on Nov 5, 2014 0:05:51 GMT -8
Looks to me like the bezel is missing, that would not help moisture resistance. My experience with vintage lacquered dials is to leave them well alone unless you are only blowing the dust off them as lacquer damaged by moisture will often lift as soon as you look at it. Do not ask me how I know, all I can say there has been much blue language in Pollys workshop on occasion:-)
I agree with Tony, looks like the discolouration is under the lacquer.
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 5, 2014 0:13:27 GMT -8
Looks to me like the bezel is missing, that would not help moisture resistance. My experience with vintage lacquered dials is to leave them well alone unless you are only blowing the dust off them as lacquer damaged by moisture will often lift as soon as you look at it. Do not ask me how I know, all I can say there has been much blue language in Pollys workshop on occasion:-) I agree with Tony, looks like the discolouration is under the lacquer. Could be, but to be sure we'll need 2 things from the guy: 1. A bigger, clearer picture of the front and 2. The case style # (or case-back shot showing it) so we can get to the proper reference examples somewhere either in my personal database (including marketing info from Seiko in mid '60s) or online somewhere (like a Japanese language reference site like Seikomatic). In fact, I'm going to check the Seikomatic pages I've saved in my own personal files & see if there are any 6206's that look like the one pictured in the OP. Will come back & update this if I can find some. UPDATE:I have both Seikomatic and Nakahiro 6206 archive pages in my own database & looked thru both. Nakahiro only had a cal. 400 model in gold (the 400 was basically the predecessor to 6206; cal. 6206 is considered a cost reduced successor to the 33j cal. 400) Seikomatic did have a SGP version of a -8990 (and the dial of his does look a lot like what should be on a -8990) and it does seem to have a thin applied bezel which his appears not to have. That is the closest match to what we see in the OP. However, he does NOT show a model with a black outer ring (having white marker lines) in the SGP case. He has another SS cased model (-8040) with a dark grey dial having a white background outer ring. So, it is possible that there is a legitimate model/variant having a white/silver dial but with the dark background outer ring. Neither Seikomatic nor Nakahiro claim to be complete in terms of all the case style types within a calibre family, and all variants within a specific case style #. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 1:22:18 GMT -8
My May 1964 6206-8990 Seikomatic Weekdater for reference (and to show off a tad of course)...  Brought off original owners son recently who stated his father was a jewellery buyer for a large London department store in Tottenham, London. The bracelet was not in the original listing and it was not until after the deal was done that the seller told me he had it and would I like to have it?!?! |
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Post by ninja01 on Nov 5, 2014 2:16:20 GMT -8
My '66 6206-8990 Seikomatic Weekdater for reference (and to show off a tad of course)... Wow, that one is interesting! If you compare it to reference examples at Seikomatic and Nakahiro, you see 2 things different from any of the 6206 and cal. 400 models shown: 1. The sword hands (Hr/Min) have lumed centers. 2. The outer dial chapter(ring) is designed very differently from the others by having the square & rectangular major unit markers. All the others shown (with separate rings) are like mine, with ONLY the painted lines: You say yours is from '66 huh? I'll have to check the date range of production in Seikomatic (if they show a range for the 6206) and see if this is either very early production (don't think so) or maybe very late, and therefore has some different features from the typical example. UPDATE: OK just checked - they show production range (that they know of) for generic 6206 production (not a specific case style): 販売開始（セイコー社資料より）：１９６４年８月 Commercial launch (From the Seiko company material): August, 1964. 最古確認個体：１９６４年５月 The oldest confirmation individual: May, 1964 最新確認個体：１９６７年２月 The latest confirmation individual: February, 1967 So, likely not real late production either unless yours is from real late in '66. What month was yours produced??? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 3:08:02 GMT -8
My '66 6206-8990 Seikomatic Weekdater for reference (and to show off a tad of course)... Wow, that one is interesting! If you compare it to reference examples at Seikomatic and Nakahiro, you see 2 things different from any of the 6206 and cal. 400 models shown: 1. The sword hands (Hr/Min) have lumed centers. 2. The outer dial chapter(ring) is designed very differently from the others by having the square & rectangular major unit markers. All the others shown (with separate rings) are like mine, with ONLY the painted lines: You say yours is from '66 huh? I'll have to check the date range of production in Seikomatic (if they show a range for the 6206) and see if this is either very early production (don't think so) or maybe very late, and therefore has some different features from the typical example. UPDATE: OK just checked - they show production range (that they know of) for generic 6206 production (not a specific case style): 販売開始（セイコー社資料より）：１９６４年８月 Commercial launch (From the Seiko company material): August, 1964. 最古確認個体：１９６４年５月 The oldest confirmation individual: May, 1964 最新確認個体：１９６７年２月 The latest confirmation individual: February, 1967 So, likely not real late production either unless yours is from real late in '66. What month was yours produced??? That is very cool information thanks! Just checked mine is June 1964 which would tally up with why a jewellery buyer working for a top London retail outlet had a pre launch watch Also probably explains why the watch is a little more 'finished' than others often seen? It's like motorbikes on the stand at a major show always have 'extra' bling details to get the buyers interested. Then when it comes to production they remove the bling and joe public doesn't even notice. My watch just entered into the relms of super cool in my collection as far as I am concerned! Thanks again ninja. |
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ibr
Can't Tell Time
Posts: 24
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Post by ibr on Nov 5, 2014 6:06:35 GMT -8
RE: " Got this Weekdater for fairly cheap" Question: Do you actually have the watch "in hand" (no pun intended with respect to your picture) or is it still "on the way" from a seller?? Reason I ask: a good number of times in my experience, the seller's shots (especially @ magnification) make a problem look really serious, but when you get the watch & see it in natural light at natural size (life-size), an apparent problem often diminishes in seriousness. Cobra: Yes, good advice!! If a "sprucing up" is indeed needed, cannibalizing is otten the best (and most cost-effective) solution to these matters. Ninja, Everyone Thanks for all the interesting posts! A lot of info to sift through here... I do have the watch in hand and can take some better photos as soon as I get home. The photo I took last night was under some rather intense light. that give it that "washed out look" To piggy back on what some others have said: the inner bezel definitely has faded minute markings, but I'm not sure about the face. It's possible they wore off, but I've seen example of the watch without anything on the face so I'm a bit confused in that regard. The crystal is a bit hazy, and the gold plating isn't exactly top notch...that being said I think I paid 30 dollars for it and my plan was to replace the face if no cleaning could be done and put it on a brown strap since I've been needing a brown-leather dress watch. Here's another shot I took last night, though I doubt that will clear anything up except how filthy the thing is:  So in short: I will take some better photos tonight, including the caseback this evening. Guess my watch photography skills need a bit of work  |
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Post by cannop on Nov 5, 2014 6:51:18 GMT -8
Just checked mine is June 1964 which would tally up with why a jewellery buyer working for a top London retail outlet had a pre launch watch Also probably explains why the watch is a little more 'finished' than others often seen? It's like motorbikes on the stand at a major show always have 'extra' bling details to get the buyers interested. Then when it comes to production they remove the bling and joe public doesn't even notice. My watch just entered into the relms of super cool in my collection as far as I am concerned! Thanks again ninja. I don't think yours is pre-launch mate, it's a lume filled 6206-8990 - I've seen a few over the years! |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2014 9:00:38 GMT -8
Just checked mine is June 1964 which would tally up with why a jewellery buyer working for a top London retail outlet had a pre launch watch Also probably explains why the watch is a little more 'finished' than others often seen? It's like motorbikes on the stand at a major show always have 'extra' bling details to get the buyers interested. Then when it comes to production they remove the bling and joe public doesn't even notice. My watch just entered into the relms of super cool in my collection as far as I am concerned! Thanks again ninja. I don't think yours is pre-launch mate, it's a lume filled 6206-8990 - I've seen a few over the years! Your probably right Duncan. The serial pre dates the official launch according to ninjas data by a few months. My watches serial number is 4603063. The owners grandson is meant to be sending me a short bio about his late grandfather who owned the watch. Nothing after 3 or so months thus far... |
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Post by cannop on Nov 5, 2014 12:10:12 GMT -8
The only thing you can be sure of with vintage Seiko is you can't be sure of anything!  |
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Post by funkster on Nov 5, 2014 12:16:46 GMT -8
Loving this thread guys - the 30J weekdaters are very cool IMO - I have a couple but unfortunately am struggling to upload any photos at the moment!  ? |
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ibr
Can't Tell Time
Posts: 24
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Post by ibr on Nov 5, 2014 14:41:04 GMT -8
  Better photos, including case back |
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Still a nice and seldom seen model.
Ninja
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